BEERCITYVAPRZ

You know, if I'm wrong correct me but, I believe a noobie posted recently that she had purchased one of these deals, and even another poster. Like I said somewhere else earlier, there are a lot of snake-oil products being sold out there. I know it's buyer beware with merchandise, but imo, this is kind of sad, and really what gives the e-cig market a bad name, let along subject to more intense scrutiny (by the you-know-who) for the honest people who are trying to make a living.

That wasn't my understanding or interpretation. Don't take this as an attack but I read the letters and as far as I could tell, it was mostly a complaint to each company that they are marketing an item that is claiming to treat a disease. The news article mentioned a cialis drug that shouldn't be there, but two companies with the cialis and other "health" drugs the complaint was not properly noting the percentage of the active ingredient. And also one with a possible contaminant, as well as, a mis-labeled drug, the FDA is complaining that its not actually cialis.


Testing by FDA's DPA also revealed that the Cialis prefilled cartridges and the Cialis Healthcare E-Liquid contained amino-tadalafil, not tadalafil, the reference listed drug in Cialis. The substitution of this ingredient renders the products adulterated under section 501(d) of the Act. (21 U.S.C 351(d)).

Here are the C&D letters, http://www.fda.gov/ICECI/EnforcementActions/WarningLetters/2010/default.htm

Look down at Sept. 8th.

Here's a complaint about penguin, its kind of laughable if it weren't so serious.

The labels of your B(4) Juice Natural Apple Juice Blend Concentrate, B(4) White Grape Juice Blend Concentrate, and B(4) Passion Fruit Juice Blend Concentrate products declare “Contains 100% Flavored Juice Blend When Reconstituted to the Mixing Ratio”; however these products do not contain 100% juice when prepared according to the package directions. We calculated the total percentage of juice in your products using your firm’s product formulation sheets and the information you provided to our investigator regarding the firm’s substitution of all juice volumes in formulations containing white grape concentrate with a 50-50 blend of apple and pear concentrate because the white grape concentrate was no longer used. Based upon our calculations, your B(4) Natural Apple Juice Blend Concentrate, B(4) White Grape Juice Blend Concentrate, and B(4) Passion Fruit Juice Blend Concentrate products actually contain approximately 89%, 89% and 91% juice respectively when reconstituted according the package directions. Therefore, the label declaration of 100% juice blend is not accurate.

The labels of your Penguin Juice Co. Orange Juice Concentrate, B(4) Pineapple Juice Concentrate, and Penguin Juice Co. Prune Juice Concentrate products do not contain declarations of percentage of juice in the product.

So again, not blasting you at all, but I think we shouldn't feed into whatever the FDA is trying to do here which appears to be scaring the companies and the consumers. I think it would be nice if they would do their job as I'm sure there are some companies out there that need "handling". Of course I could be horribly wrong and if I am, someone please let me know. I bought a boatload of JC juice just in case. ;-)

GOD DAMN Katherine Hiegl is HOT!!!!!

GOD DAMN Katherine Hiegl is HOT!!!!!

GOD DAMN Katherine Hiegl is HOT!!!!!

GOD DAMN Katherine Hiegl is HOT!!!!!

yeah the 250 price tag is insain. you can buy some of the best mods out there for well over 100 less and last 4 days on a single charge.
the key to remember is that the 250 was worth it for switching over. so don't focus on the money, but don't buy anything from them again.

now anyone saying one cartomizer or cartridge lasts = to a carton is full of bs.
vape when and however much you feel like it.

what it looks like you have is an 808 kit.
i say use that till it dies or you want something that lasts longer.
if you want better performance you can check into an ego or a mod.
personally i tend to stick with the 510 attys and cartomizers.

buy juice in the bottles like you would find here at the vt store along with empty cartos and attys
this way you can fill your own and save cash and time. the prefilled stuff pretty much sucks.

As a tobacco flavor person I rarely sample any thing other then tobacco flavors. I just purchased 150ml bottle of Carmel Tobacco 32mg from Blue Mist. I ordered it "extra flavor" which emphasizes the carmel flavor and the tobacco flavor lighter. I must say I was pleasantly surprised with this mix. I never thought I would like it. It is a quality mix, and the price, $25.50. American made! I was also surprised that they also included a small 10ml 32mg bottle of Belgian Waffle for me to try. I like this a lot too and will definitely be ordering more of it. If you think it's impossible to get quality juice, service and dirt cheap prices for American made juices, think again! I highly recommend Blue Mist!!!

Alot of the juices out there have a bit of a chemical aftertaste to me, so I really like the organic flavors from vaperite.com. I tend to go more for the coffee flavors, so I would climb any mountain for Vaperite Organic Kona Cream.

Remember when you smoked analogs, and you thought nothing went together better than a cigarette and a cup of coffee. Since I started vaping, I really don't want that smokey taste of an analog cigarette anywhere near me, but there's still something appealing about the concept of a cigarette and a cup of coffee. You can have thick plumes of vapor and the taste of the best cup of coffee you ever had, all rolled into one with Vaperite Organic Kona Cream.

Stringdancer, that was one of the BEST, if not THE best posts Ive read since being a member here. I have read it twice now, and cant find one point I dont agree with. The governments justification for banning these products IS ridiculous, and is based on greed not need. There was a thing on Fox news today about a product coming out that helps parents "monitor" where theier teenage children are, to help them keep an eye on them. Right there is a problem. We DONT need products to do the parenting for us, we need PARENTS to take responsibility. My father knew where I was damn near all the time, and I knew the thundering hand of God was coming down if I stepped out of line. Not in an abusive way, in an authoritative way. The man LOVED me and i loved him back and I NEVER got what I didnt deserve. Im getting a little off track here, but it starts somewhere, and this is one area. The spare the rod mentality. The "It takes a village to raise a child" mentality. It doesnt take a village, it takes a parent. And we need to stop infringing on everyones rights in essence to make it easier for someone else to cope with parenthood. Flavors and bells and whistles dont make akid go astray. Non supervision does.

A great thread here.

Now, I'm all for safety, and feel the FDA should get off its butt and begin scientific, non-biased studies of ecigs. I'm not interested in the typical "study" paid for by corporate interests on either side of the ecig fence... I'd like to see real research NOT driven by market agendas.

Packaging can be managed, as Chris has done with the child-proof caps. But there is only so much a manufacturer can do to ensure safety when dealing with a potentially toxic product. Just because e-juice holds the potential of poisoning a person or pet does not mean it shouldn't be sold, and is no justification for keeping it off the market. Were that the case, then we shouldn't have access to many household, garage and industrial products either, which is clearly absurd and way too "nanny-state" for me.

As for nicotine itself... well, I'm on the side of personal liberty here. Adults are responsible for their choices, and if they want to smoke, it's their funeral. If vapers want to continue vaping and NOT use ecigs as a cessation path, it's their choice as well. Nicotine is often likened to caffeine in terms of negative health effects. Simply changing the delivery system for nicotine from burning leaves to something as benign (we assume) as vaping is a giant step forward in and of itself (based on all available data and vaper testimonials). Common sense tells us (well... me, anyway) that vaping is less harmful by orders of magnitude. Unless and until real data surfaces to suggest otherwise, I personally have no problem with substituting vaping for smoking and feeling pretty good about it.

Coffee drinkers, alcohol drinkers, drug users, food addicts (addicts of every stripe, for that matter) make their choices and must deal with the consequences, and I would argue that the government should have no say in those choices. Prohibition should have taught us that personal behavior can only be encouraged, not mandated and controlled by legislation (no matter how well-intended), because such hard-fisted attempts at social control simply don't work, and is counter to the concept of personal liberty and subsequent responsibility.

We are constantly being told what to do, but much less emphasis is placed on why we should do it. If but a fraction of the money spent on the so-called "war on drugs" had been spent on comprehensive, un-biased education of our youth on the science and traditional uses of various substances, on the cultural backdrop of the peoples who have used substances (I'm thinking specifically of Native American substance use and the accompanying spiritual ceremony here), we would have much less of a drug problem today. Native Americans used substances for specific reasons, at specified times, with specific ceremony and meaning infused into the practice. Such conscious and purposeful use of substances has all but disappeared. Back in the 60s and early 70s, the reasons behind why hippies used various drugs were entirely different than the what-the-hell party atmosphere we see today. There's such a thing as responsible, purposeful substance use, and then there's drug abuse. I may take some flack for that stand, but I was there, and I've seen the degrading cultural milieu surrounding the use of substances over the years first-hand. It didn't have to be that way, but the government's "do what we say but we won't educate you as to why you should do it" approach has only led to further inappropriate use of substances. Again... education is the answer, not legislation.

Perhaps that rant seems a bit off-topic, but I'm inclined to say it isn't. What is true of our dysfunctional approach to substance use is certainly true of our similarly bone-headed approach to cigarettes and tobacco use generally.

That's enough for now. I'm spent. lol

what i find funny is that last year fda was blocking ecigs and was told it couldn't by a court.
so what makes them think they can do it now? ie: why are they taking peoples packages like they have done to chris?

i say its time to sue the fda for wrongful seizure and violating a court ruling.

This is what could happen if E-cigs are banned!

that is great!

Vapeheads!

Now this is cool! Someone reposted the video we made!!!!! Just awesome! LOL! I'm the dealer by the way! Vape On!!!!!!!!

I think there is some concern about what else "could" get in the juice. There are a lot of suppliers popping up and I doubt very many of them have sterile labs. You just don't know who they are or what the mixing conditions are. I think it's a valid concern. The person mixing the juice could have a serious drooling problem and you'd never know. LOL! Or they could be a cat lover and have a few cats rubbing around them while mixing. You just don't know. So really, for me, it's not about the price, it's about not knowing who's making it. However, you can say the same thing about any juice supplier, USA, China or otherwise.

I wouldn't vape any thing under 18mgs at any price, be like vaping air.

I know many are trying to cut out the nic all together and working their way down, I am not.

I see no reason to smoke or vape if there is no nic, th or head rush.

I never got a head rush, low resistance helps with TH as does a good menthol (which is what I smoked). But if you look back, I sure was scrambling for ideas on how to get a TH, my wife wanted it more than I did, I think the rush as well. Being a weekend smoker she probably got the rush from oxygen deprivation not TH off the first cig of the week. I tried higher voltage but the ego with a low resistance carto or atty is pretty good.

I did 0mg for health reasons (also have to remember to apply for non-smoker status on insurance, I think it's half the cost). In retrospect it certainly makes the FDA stuff a little less stressful to me. I'm pretty sure even if I lose all my hardware, I wouldn't need to go back to analogues. The burning urge to smoke/vape at least every hour disappeared after I went to 0mg. Now triggered only by stress and drinking, and even then sometimes the battery is not charged and its no big deal not being able to. Some peoples brains are just wired differently, what worked for me may not for someone else but I always suggest folks give it a whirl. There was zero stress for me while I did it, dropped about 2mg every week or two and lost the urge after two weeks or so at 0mg. Around 5 or 6 mg/ml is where we lost the TH and that was nasty, we kept going, wife complaining all the way. Once low resistance showed up I saw a big smile on the wife's face.

Thank goodness there is such a variety of prices out there in vapeland! Some of the companies can really afford to pass along the savings to us the customer, while others are still struggling to get enough money together to do the same. Eventually the Mom and Pop stores will be able to pass along greater savings as long as they keep being the best of the best in all other regards and we keep supporting them whenever we can afford to. I love having a fortress of cheaper eliquid on hand so I can then buy from my favorite stores or flavors plus try out mew ones. I wish attys were cheaper! I can always make my own eliquid. All in all, we get the best of both worlds, and I appreciate them all.

you are absolutly right, very well said.

Honestly, this is a pretty comforting article though. I cannot hope more that the case will be postponed. Good find, man!

My coffee maker is a drug delivery device.

Burn, that may make sense; but, by that same logic, then cigarettes would have to be classified as drug delivery devices as well.

There lies the problem with the drug delivery device argument and it depends on how far you want to take it. The bottom line is it will cost serious money to fight the FDA.

The real problem as I see it was this ..



Basically they gave a next to useless agency even more power to be even more useless.