Uma

Im sure there are many people who don't smoke that appreciate vaping over smoking, be it loved ones, coworkers etc..

I've said it before, and I'll say it again.

I miss the United States of America. It was an awesome country. Now I'm stuck in 'merica.
^ There is just SO much in that statement ^

I've been saying for a while that it is time for another "shot to be heard around the world".

Or how about we fight for our rihhts!! Are forfathers didnt want us on a tight leash and theres no way we should be,it makes me sick!! All the bad **** out there and they say there bad for kids..how about video games? killing,raping,and stealing must be fine for them?!?!


But seriously,whould love to get together and take our control back!!! America is saposed to be the land of the free,not the land that stripes our rights and cost a big fee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wtf

I don't understand the flavor limiting. I can buy cotton ******* candy flavored VODKA for **** sake! COTTON CANDY VODKA! Not to mention a product called Deliciouso (i think) Red Velvet. Tastes like cake! It has 0 booze taste, it's literally liquid cake I can get ****** up on! What kid doesnt love cake? In fact, its my childish side that loves that liquid cake! Why cant parents just be responsible enough to keep tabs on their rugrats?! I put up with 18 and 21 years of "childhood" so I WOULDN'T have my things taken away anymore. Now instead of mom taking it away, its my damn government. At least mom didnt want to be PAID to take my things away! Hey, mommy-government.... Where's my allowance?! Sorry... snapped a bit for a moment. This whole thing just enfuriates me. Lol, I say we all run away from home and build a fort in another country! Totally not come back when it gets dark out!

I am not sure what Im going to do if Im stuck on "tobacco" flavored cigalikes. I love the taste of a cigarette, but tobacco ejuice sucks. However, the other flavors that arent trying to taste like tobacco work great for me. I hate my government as much as my governemnt doesnt care about me.

The only problem I have with big tobacco getting involved is that they told the FDA a couple of months ago that they would have no problem with restricting online sales (you can still buy cigarettes and cigars online) and limit flavors. It's easier for all the cigalikes to get stocked in convenience stores, but it's harder to get a good selection of juices and equipment, much less qualified staff to help with it. There are some areas sort of around here where you have to drive an hour and a half plus to get to a B&M, much less one that stocks flavors you like, the brands you normally order. Before June, we would have to drive an hour, but then four new stores opened up in the space of five months.

Wow, an article that actually presents facts instead of going for the "it's dangerous and going to kill our kids!" scare tactic.

Thanks for the link, Uma.

I don't know if they add these intentionally, or if it forms because of the various chemicals they do add combine and form them, but they add MAOIs, which is where the REAL addictive properties lie. If you aren't familiar with them, look them up. They are OLD SCHOOL anti-depressant, I don't know what else they were used for. They are like, the last option for anti-depressants now, as in most docs won't prescribe them, because they interact with so many medications, but the amount in cigarettes isn't enough to interact with meds, but just enough to enhance the addiction.

And, at least for me, the REAL addiction, other than that, was not only the nicotine, but the hand to mouth movement. We continued to smoke analogs for about 10 days after picking up vaping - finishing what we had, and then because of a VERY stressful situation that we just didn't know how to cope with without the crutch of analogs (until we found ourselves hitting the e-cig WHILE we were smoking analogs, because the e-cig tasted better). I had two slip up days, one was a family reunion that everyone was smoking at practically, so I had pretty much planned on smoking two. The other was an even MORE stressful situation, on August 14, and I was with my sister so there were analogs available, and I just.....well, I was weak, and I was worried, and it happened - three analogs that day. Other than those five analogs, I've been analog free since July 27th at 2 am.

Most of the PRESS coverage I've seen has been negative - usually focusing on the risk of exploding batteries, unless you a celebrity doing it on a talk show (Katherine Heigl comes to mind), or a commercial, again a celebrity. But the talk show instance very much makes me thing "commercial" (and all of these things - Blu, and another brand - are cigalikes) and wonder if they contacted the e-cig company and asked if they could do that on the talk show, and would they get any consideration (ie compensation, free product - not that they have any shortage of money - etc.) for doing it.


They care about the tax dollars, but at the same time, they care about the MILLIONS in Medicare payments they have to pay out when you get cancer, become disabled, and if you don't have "creditable coverage" from a spouse working, or if you reach your maximum lifetime benefit limit (before the Affordable Care Act) - which was the entire reason behind the tobacco settlement. To reimburse the state expenses for Medicaid, and reimburse the federal expenses for disability and Medicare payments caused by people disabled by cancer or a smoking related illness on disability and Medicare.

I don't know about other states, but I know Missouri didn't even use the tobacco settlement for Medicaid.

Don't worry about sounding like a conspiracy theorist. I think in one way or another, all of us vapers are since the FDA has ALWAYS been threatening to get involved, since way back in 2008, and even took to court - but since it was classified as tobacco and under THAT regulation and not a drug delivery device via the federal court decision in 2011, they are running out of time to take action on it.

The thing is - I think it was one of the links you posted, or maybe it was something I read on my own. Big pharma only manages to help 15% of smokers quit. Why? IMO, it's not addressing the behavioral (therefore psychological) addiction. Yeah, suckers work for some, but not for all. Plus, the patches, the lozenges, etc., don't replace the same amount of nicotine you were taking in, and letting you step down as slowly as you want. The lozenges and the gum only address cravings as they come, and again, that's the nic craving, not the behavioral stuff.

Golly, I was going to type more, but now I've forgotten because I started this so many hours ago.....

Nice article and good to see someone is making a point of, lets look at evidence before we crucify.

Thanks Uma!

WoW that Sarge is certifiable LOL. I hate people that have this attitude that I did it cold turkey and your just a dum@$#$ because you can't. Or the, I don't Vape so you can't either crowd. I applaud what this Sen. Did!

Big Pharma makes a killing. Big Pharma is one of the corps that will lead the Trans Pacific pact thingie. Here is a small blurb about the TPP you'll have to google to super research it. http://reason.com/archives/2013/11/16/the-tpp-obamas-dangerous-international-d.
There are many "theorists" out there like Alex Jones, etc who have compiled tons of info over the years and are now screaming at the top of their lungs to wake up America. Take it or leave it, there it be.
Research "Agenda 21" & "Common Good" and all that jazz. There's a good video named Agenda 21 for dummies, with speeches from those who were in on it all in the beginning planning stages, that might help to understand the paranoia our country is under.
I'm new to all this stuff, new to politics, new to activism, new new new, but all these things are connected with WHO as the base advisory, planning, promoting, whatever board.
The FDA, big Pharma, CDC, WHO, are all connected in theories that aren't even vaping related. I stumbled upon these other theories while researching for why CDC, FDA, Who, and others are lying about vaping.
It's not paranoia when they're really after ya.
Take my words with a grain of salt. Like I said, I'm just stumbling around accidentally uncovering stuff. True or false? I haven't a clue, but when they fight safer alternatives while shoveling MonSantos, chemo, arsenic rice, arsenic chicken, mercury vaccines, ... Plumb island experimental lab, new prisons called "residential centers" next to railroad tracks, .... And so much more, ... it's enough to make one raise an eyebrow. Both eyebrows raise when they start confiscating self ptotection weapons, practice civil unrest, towns arming themselves with tanks fit for battle...
Got charmin?

ECig Regulating.
By Dr. Ross

http://www.nicotinepolicy.net/gilbert-ross/516-smoking-kills-and-so-might-e-cigarette-regulation

"Effectively excluding e-cigarettes from the market via stringent regulation would have the effect of killing smokers and protecting cigarette and pharmaceutical markets. E-cigarettes, a far safer form of nicotine delivery, should not be submitted to tougher regulation than cigarettes.

Americans should not have to die from misguided regulation."

The entire article is quotable.

Article written, JULY 22, 2013
Ecig Bill (asking states to set age restriction) is called a Trojan Horse
http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2013/07/22/e-cigarette-bill-called-trojan-horse.html

"Anti-smoking advocates say that below the surface of House Bill 144 is a tobacco-industry-crafted Trojan horse designed to ensure that the emerging electronic-cigarette market and other alternative nicotine products remain taxed at a lower rate than traditional cigarettes and stay outside the states indoor smoking ban".
Follow the tax money. :$

First, dear attorney generals, eCigs are NOT smokes.
Second, they pose no health threats to non-vapers.
Third, ex-smokers should not have to breathe in smoke or be tempted by smoke or smell like smoke or be treated like smokers.
Fourth, I could go on all day, but will spare you.

Dr. Farsalinos of Onassis Research Center has dedicated his research time and efforts to the pros and cons of the eCig.
http://www.ecigarette-research.com/web/index.php/research

The results of the study showed that e-cigarette vapor was by far less cytotoxic than tobacco cigarette smoke, with most of the samples showing absolutely no adverse effects on the cells.
http://www.ecigarette-research.com/web/index.php/research/135-evaluation-of-the-cytotoxic

Acknowledging the significant potential of electronic cigarettes as smoking alternatives and based on the scientific evidence which clearly indicated that they are much safer, it is important that health authorities will regulate these products in a way that will promote rather than restrict their availability and use by smokers who are unable to quit with currently approved medical methods.
http://www.ecigarette-research.com/web/index.php/research/127-no-adverse-effects

However, a significant message from this study is that the daily use of electronic cigarettes does not hinder the beneficial effects of smoking cessation.
Chronic idiopathic neutrophilia, relieved after smoking cessation with the use of electronic cigarette
http://www.ecigarette-research.com/web/index.php/research/94-chronic-idiopathic-neutrophilia-relieved-after-smoking-cessation-with-the-use-of-electronic-cigarette


http://www.ecigarette-research.com/web/index.php/research/100-clearstream-life-accepted-for-publication

Dr. Farsalinos is studying Flavors at the moment, and hopes to study various wires, (kanthal vs Nichocrome(sp), etc..
He is dedicated to investigating every aspect to vaping there is. Bookmark his site, sign up for the news releases.

He also has a segment which debunks unprofessional studies, he exposes lies, and more. Worth clicking on every subject link.

The towns, cities, states, and countries are under seige. There's too many at a time to post about here. Please visit ECF legislature sub forum to keep abreast, and also please join CASAA.org for info. Even CASAA has their hands full trying to keep abreast.
ECF http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/legislation-news/
e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/legislation-news/

A few of the many facing threats:
Washington
Spain
Canada
Europe
NYC
Chicago
Beverly Hills
Your town USA & not so USA

Watch your local towns, cities, city council agenda announcements. They are sneaking in meetings with just a few days notice, called "emergency" meetings.

Why are they doing this? Namely 3 main reasons, all of them centered around money.
1. TSET (tobacco settlement endowment trust like http://www.ok.gov/tset/Grants/) whose smoke money is dwindling extremely fast as more and more smokers switch to vaping. Their programs are under threat of becoming extinct. Their pockets are drying up. The TSET divvies the money up amongst various "health" groups, such as ACA, ALA, ETC, towards tobacco control programs.
2. Smoke tax money is dwindling for the states. The states rely on smoke taxes, gas taxes, carbon taxes, etc, but the money coming in from smoke tax has extremely reduced because of the eCigs popularity. The Attorney Generals of each greedy state are trying desperately to ban the eCig, if they can't be taxed like smokes, which is why they demonize them, to prep for excessive taxes. Until they can tax them the same, they want them completely banned, to force smokers to smoke and keep the tax money rolling in. It's their cash cow, and the cow is drying up.
3. Big Pharma is also showing losses on their smoking cessation products, along with the products associated with smoking. (Allergy pills, cough Meds, etc). Companies, such as the Chantix company, are even going so far as to promote Nicotine Free world instead of smoke free world. Why? Because they promote quitting nicotine without using nicotine. Chantix is owned by Pfizer, pfizer is owned by Johnson & Johnson, Johnson & Johnson is owned by the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation. The RWF is a foundation which gives grants to towns, cities, universities, etc, towards a nicotine free world.
4. Many of these greedy politicians, cities, are vying for grants and bonuses, smoke tax, from all of the above.
TSET, for example, has been rumored to promote 3 levels of grants, and if a city also bans eCigs, they will receive all 3 levels of grant money. (Bronze, silver, gold).

All these towns are reaching for quick financial rewards, that will dry up quickly, instead of taking their power back. They could easily fix their broken bank accounts by rolling back regulations, taxes, and more. Giving power back to individual business owners, giving spending money back to the working man by not taxing him to death, and so much more. Reason.com recently released a powerful article, explaining just this. http://reason.com/archives/2013/12/03/fixing-california-freer-markets-and-fewe

Please, jump in, visit the Legislature sub forum daily, write your congressman, city councils, sign petitions, join the Twitter bombs, ... There is a LOT each of us can do to save our right to vape.

Many of us have been doing outstanding jobs of fighting the fight, and a huge cyber hug isn't big enough to show us all the appreciation felt by every Vaper out there.
Others don't realize there is a dire fight going on. Hence the reason for this thread.
There is zero time to waste.

Let's fill this thread with the studies that prove eCigs are safer than smokes, minors are not becoming addicted to nicotine like the professional fear mongers say they do (this one is so dam laughable. Hookah pens, popular amongst curious minors, are ZERO NIC, so please, tell us again how vaping zero nic addicts people to nic).
Refutes and debunks, all needed here. A library of truths, a quick reference.

Let's get 'er done.

Awesome article. Truly, I don't know what I would do if they took nicotine containing e-cigs off the market. Then again, I'm down to 8 mg nic, if they still allowed 0 nic juice on the market, I guess I could try going 0 nic and hope to keep from picking up an analog.

Smoking won't kill you instantly. If you grow sick with cancer or whatever the various entities that own the politicians will then get a growing piece of your paycheck. As long as you have insurance you are a revenue generator until you're finally in the ground or reduced to ashes.

Then explain why they would prefer I smoke instead of vape. Or why they let health care remain just outside my reach. Or any of the other stupid **** they do

This whole e-cig thing nust cements in my mind that my government does not care about me, or if I live or die. They only care about how much of my paycheck they get.

ECig Regulating.
By Dr. Ross

http://www.nicotinepolicy.net/gilbert-ross/516-smoking-kills-and-so-might-e-cigarette-regulation

"Effectively excluding e-cigarettes from the market via stringent regulation would have the effect of killing smokers and protecting cigarette and pharmaceutical markets. E-cigarettes, a far safer form of nicotine delivery, should not be submitted to tougher regulation than cigarettes.

Americans should not have to die from misguided regulation."

The entire article is quotable.

ECig Regulating.
By Dr. Ross

http://www.nicotinepolicy.net/gilbert-ross/516-smoking-kills-and-so-might-e-cigarette-regulation

"Effectively excluding e-cigarettes from the market via stringent regulation would have the effect of killing smokers and protecting cigarette and pharmaceutical markets. E-cigarettes, a far safer form of nicotine delivery, should not be submitted to tougher regulation than cigarettes.

Americans should not have to die from misguided regulation."

The entire article is quotable.

ECig Regulating.
By Dr. Ross

http://www.nicotinepolicy.net/gilbert-ross/516-smoking-kills-and-so-might-e-cigarette-regulation

"Effectively excluding e-cigarettes from the market via stringent regulation would have the effect of killing smokers and protecting cigarette and pharmaceutical markets. E-cigarettes, a far safer form of nicotine delivery, should not be submitted to tougher regulation than cigarettes.

Americans should not have to die from misguided regulation."

The entire article is quotable.